Masculinity in the new millennium.

[Black_equus]

Over in the Manhattan section, a few conversations have flared up around the topic of men vs women, gender roles, etc.

https://www.ampreviews.net/index.php?threads/review-sl-allyssas-incredible-insights.150221/ for example.

Over the last 60 years, modern feminism has had a singular goal; achieving gender equality. And many metrics indicate success in those areas.

On the other hand, men have not had a vision specific to gender. Based on many of the conversations on this board, there is a sentiment that men/boys are at best, adrift and at worse, demonized in today's culture.

The status quo seems unacceptable. So what is the path forward in providing boys and young men a positive framework that is currently being filled by the likes of Andrew Tate and other mysoginists?

 

[Don Hollinger]

Fascinating 9 plus pages of reflection centered around a provider and mostly thoughtful New Yorkers. And the insights from men who don't have to put up a front and put it all out make this site at times a very good one. At times. It's a worthy read about our deviant lifestyle.

For me, in my mid 60's, intellectual thought and shpilkes over gender roles and the future of men and women--I don't care. And the lovely thing about paid, consensual sex is that I don't have to do any virtue signaling. And I pay well for my companions to assume a traditional gender role.

As for the path forward for young men and role models it's always been teachers, coaches, regular guys, mensches--not hot messes like Andrew Tate.

 

[VJLUTZ]

I think Andrew Tate makes some very valid points though, like @Don Hollinger, I don't care for the messenger. My own thought is that Society has been in overdrive over the last 30 years trying to feminize young men. And social media does not help. There will be a hefty price to pay for that at some point for both men and women. You can already see it with the falling birth and marriage rates. Plus the latest stats are that over one third of men under 30 aren't having sex. Like I've said a few times, I'm glad I came of age before this shit-storm.

 

[PorterD]

On a larger society scale: It’s hopeless. The first step to fixing a problem is seeing one exists; and we aren’t there. In fact in most cases we are heading further in the direction of women needing more power and men needing to be knocked down more. So it needs to obviously get much worse before it gets better.

The only thing a man can do is live his truth. Tune out the noise and not give a crap what society thinks of him. Because despite all the bullshit; women deep down; still want a MAN. So if you can be that; you will stand out now.

 

[Black_equus]

I think Andrew Tate makes some very valid points though, like @Don Hollinger, I don't care for the messenger. My own thought is that Society has been in overdrive over the last 30 years trying to feminize young men. And social media does not help. There will be a hefty price to pay for that at some point for both men and women. You can already see it with the falling birth and marriage rates. Plus the latest stats are that over one third of men under 30 aren't having sex. Like I've said a few times, I'm glad I came of age before this shit-storm.

Andrew Tate is only good at describing the problem. What he offers as a solution is problematic to say the least.

I don't think masculinity has any fixed value. In some eras it was totally normal for western European males to act feminine by today's standards; make up, high heels and wigs were all started with men.

That, and the fact Gen Z is rapidly embracing gender plurality means what is considered traditional masculinity is going to change rapidly.

So how do we, as the elders, help today's boys and young men understand masculinity in way that is affirming and positive.

 

[PorterD]

I don’t think there is any gender plurality. Women want “equality” but want the man to pay for dates. I could give you 100 more examples like that. Women want “equality” when it comes to being ceos. They don’t want this so called “equality” when it comes to hard labor construction jobs. They only want equality that benefits them.

That’s not equality; it’s superiority.

 

[VJLUTZ]

What he offers as a solution is problematic to say the least.

Unfortunately, I don't think there are any workable/practical solutions. This is a cultural problem and the trend won't change on a dime. The Feminist train has been rolling (and speeding up) since 1960 or so. The only thing that might stop/reverse it is some kind of reactionary revolution (e.g., revoking the right of women to vote), societal collapse or apocalypse. None of those qualifies as a "solution" in my mind. However, if current trends remain unchecked, it could eventually lead to a societal collapse, but likely after I am safely dead.

 

[이 회장님]

I told both of my sisters and niece that a woman belongs at home—cook, clean and take care of the kids. Us men will go out and make money for the family.

I also told both of my sisters that their bad parenting led to this generation Z of spoiled, weak and lazy young adults.

 

[AutomaticSlim]

I told both of my sisters and niece that a woman belongs at home—cook, clean and take care of the kids. Us men will go out and make money for the family.

I also told both of my sisters that their bad parenting led to this generation Z of spoiled, weak and lazy young adults.

100% agree.
Pre 1960s male/female dynamics is the only way to have a healthy society.

How to get back to that is the issue...

 

[mikemendez]

Lots has to do with the American diet, low testosterone level and such. Men don’t have the same sexual drive as generations before us add to that the culture. I interact with quite a few people throughout the week at parts stores and Home Depot etc, it’s getting more difficult to figure out if the cashier is male or female.

 

[PorterD]

The problem too is; while men are getting more feminine; women are getting more masculine. Biologically speaking women deep down want to be in their feminine state so finding a man that is strong enough to break down her masculinity is difficult.

 

[PorterD]

I have a friend; good looking guy; makes decent money. Has his life together. Had No kids; was never married. But Total beta simp with no self esteem. He got hoodwinked by some pink haired overweight broke single mom with 4 kids. She got him to marry her. She got him to buy her a house and worst of it, he got her pregnant. She wears the pants, treats him like dirt, and one day she will bone him in divorce court.

 

[이 회장님]

My sister and her 8-year-old son came to visit this summer. This kid would look at his phone all the damn time.

I told him to put it down while we are together. And he would get kinda upset which pissed me off. If he was my son then he would have gotten a spanking and a harsh talk.

If I did that to my late dad then he would have ripped me in half.

But today’s parents like my sister will let it go and buy them ice cream and take them to American Dream whenever they want. smh.

 

[이 회장님]

I have a friend; good looking guy; makes decent money. Has his life together. Had No kids; was never married. But Total beta simp with no self esteem. He got hoodwinked by some pink haired overweight broke single mom with 4 kids. She got him to marry her. She got him to buy her a house and worst of it, he got her pregnant. She wears the pants, treats him like dirt, and one day she will bone him in divorce court.

Damn that’s very unfortunate. I don’t understand men who go this route.

 

[PorterD]

Damn that’s very unfortunate. I don’t understand men who go this route.

I think it’s rooted in self esteem and being weak. He thinks he can’t do any better. He takes the first woman who shows him attention. I try to talk sense to him and it doesn’t register. His previous gf was a paraplegic confined to a wheel chair, needed a catheter, etc . I kid you not. So I guess this was an upgrade for him.

 

[DS71]

I agree with most of what has been said and I agree with the statement "there just aren't many workable solutions". Most men are just going along with it because there isn't anything they can do about it.

 

[VJLUTZ]

He takes the first woman who shows him attention.

A lot of guys are like that. They think they will never get laid. Then, when some girl finally fucks them, they think she is "The One". Poor bastards.

 

[VJLUTZ]

https://www.ampreviews.net/index.php?threads/review-sl-allyssas-incredible-insights.150221/ for example.

I read the thread this morning. Alyssa the spa girl had lots of good insights. Excellent post!

 

[richardp2918]

I think it’s rooted in self esteem and being weak. He thinks he can’t do any better. He takes the first woman who shows him attention. I try to talk sense to him and it doesn’t register. His previous gf was a paraplegic confined to a wheel chair, needed a catheter, etc . I kid you not. So I guess this was an upgrade for him.

Reminds me of a quote from Ferris Bueller's Day Off when Ferris is talking about Cameron after he goes catatonic from the Ferrari mileage increase. Guys need to ask girls out and learn to deal with rejection and success so they have some bearings in how to navigate this world.

 

[mikemendez]

One parent households where a single or divorced mom is raising boys all the while there isn’t a male role model in the home teaching them man stuff, yard work, mechanics, washing a car etc so boys take on feminine traits. Most kids nowadays grow up playing video games or doing social media with a false sense of who or what they are. On the opposite side are the rednecks, kids grow up hunting, fishing, riding four wheelers, learning to fix stuff and are toughened up by the present dad. They are holding the line over here so to speak.